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1555 yards and one mile, original MN sniper '43 Tula PU.

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1555 yards and one mile, original MN sniper '43 Tula PU.

Postby Ombre noire » Wed Jan 22, 2014 1:12 pm

Hi guys

Haven't checked for a while what's going on in the MN world but here is a small contribution of keeping the fun alive :thumbup:
Short report, my buddy was filming, so the video should be available within a few days, once he is done editing.
Yesterday (1/21/14), Jean (next to dry lake bed), NV, 0800 h.
Rifle: 1943 Mosin-Nagant sniper.
Scope: 1943 PU, original.
Mods: Not much, brass/cork shims, sanded inside lower hand guard to give a bit more room to barrel/shims, slightly bent trigger spring to reach about 3.5 lbs trigger pull.
Ammo: Reloads.
Powder: 52.5 gr of Accurate 4350.
Primer: Federal (regular).
Bullet: Sierra 174 gr BTHP (.311 diameter,.303 cal)
Rifle slugged at .313.
As we were going to shoot a mile with our .338's LM (SAC and TRG42), I also took my '43 Tula sniper PU, just for the hell of it.
Shooting conditions were great (no wind). Targets were set up at 1555 yards and one mile; the furthest I ever shot the MN was 960 yards, before yesterday.
The goal was a mile, the 1555 was in case a mile would be too far. I actually wanted the first target closer (1300 yards) but our FFP did not give us a visual before 1555; too many bushes, we were shooting prone.
outstandingly :thumbdown: (should know better), didn't take note of all details but will do so next time, as I intend to do this again; so this is what I recall.
Started at 1555, didn't touch windage (0), 13 elevation. Looked at the target through the PU...and could't see it (ground and backdrop were light beige sand, not enough contrast). Target was metal silhouette 15"x24", painted white with red circle in middle. Went back to target and painted it orange fluo; back to FFP, now I could see it. First 3 shots were short but not too bad, played with elevation a bit (had some left after 13), finally got on target and grazed the holding pole twice but not the target; impacts were a few inches low but real close, windage was dead on, it was time for a mile shot . As I only had 17 rounds left (started wit 23 reloads that I made a while ago), once I realized the 1555 was doable repetitively, I switched to a mile; after all, this was the final goal.
Had to max out PU, took a shot...and was short of about 30 yards or more; the one mile target was a 24"x30" metal silhouette and due to the location, I could see this one, even though it was painted white. Amazingly, it was possible, most of the times, to see the dust report of the shots hitting the sand; I would have never thought that could be possible with the 3.5 PU but there it was. Also had 2 spotters to help (spotting scope and camera), a must in that case.
As PU was maxed out, I started using several bushes located above the target, as aiming points. Wind started to pick up some but still low. The crappy part was the post being so thick, it was covering the target, when aiming at the bushes but by the time the bullet reached the target (few seconds), I had plenty of time to move the rifle/scope to re-acquire a decent visual on target itself.
Did I managed to hit the target at a mile with my remaining 16 rounds...no...but it came so darn close many times, talking a foot or two, sometimes a bit more; darn this was frustrating...but awesome :thumbup: .
I hope the video will turn out good; it was a fun day. I will shoot again at 1555 yards but will make it the primary goal, as a mile is...a bit too far. Now, would I stand in front of an original MN sniper PU at a mile? Hell no! Anything able to hit that close to a target will send me right down to the next ditch :lol:

That's all folks :wave:
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Re: 1555 yards and one mile, original MN sniper '43 Tula PU.

Postby Grimstod » Wed Jan 22, 2014 1:36 pm

Great report Ombre!!

Shooting that fare is really hard I bet. Farthest I have shot is 475 and that was challenging.

Your ammo is no doubt subsonic by 1200yards so accuracy will go way down. This is why its so hard to hit stuff that far.
You should try to get some bullets that either have a Higher BC or perhaps go to a powder charge that gives you more velocity so your bullets stays supersonic. Once the bullet gets slow enough to come back below the speed of sound it gets literally nocked off course by the change. Here is a video that should explain this. What your doing is very fun and hard.

Watch on youtube.com


I am actually trying to build a mosin that can keep bullets supersonic out past 1500y. Its going to require special bullets and a supper long barrel. I am calling it Desh.
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Re: 1555 yards and one mile, original MN sniper '43 Tula PU.

Postby Shepard » Wed Jan 22, 2014 1:59 pm

That is some great shooting with a stock rifle. I hope that I'm able to locate a place with that range -- Right now I have about 1200yd available and it requires a lot of walking for the people who help me. Can't wait to see the video. Keep up the good work.
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Re: 1555 yards and one mile, original MN sniper '43 Tula PU.

Postby Ombre noire » Thu Jan 23, 2014 11:05 am

Grimstod wrote:Great report Ombre!!

Shooting that fare is really hard I bet. Farthest I have shot is 475 and that was challenging.

Your ammo is no doubt subsonic by 1200yards so accuracy will go way down. This is why its so hard to hit stuff that far.
You should try to get some bullets that either have a Higher BC or perhaps go to a powder charge that gives you more velocity so your bullets stays supersonic. Once the bullet gets slow enough to come back below the speed of sound it gets literally nocked off course by the change. Here is a video that should explain this. What your doing is very fun and hard.

Watch on youtube.com


I am actually trying to build a mosin that can keep bullets supersonic out past 1500y. Its going to require special bullets and a supper long barrel. I am calling it Desh.



Grimstod

Thanks for sending this; did not have time to watch video yet but will do for sure. I have a lot of respect for TRex; he is a hell of a shot and knows his stuff darn well. I recommended his videos to a few friends shooting ELR, good stuff :thumbup:
ELR is always challenging, agreed (changing winds and all that comes with long range shooting); this one even more so, mostly due to the PU 3.5 power but it is a blast to have a rifle from that era sending pills that far. I had no idea if I would see the target, or how my loads would handle the distance. To tell you the truth, I did not run these loads through the chrony yet, I am assuming they are around 2400 fps, so very mild but that's only a guess. I started to use Accurate 4350 when looking for a substitute powder for varget, as I wanted to save my Varget for my .308's. I ran test of my usual 44.6 varget load vs different loads of Accurate 4350 and saw that 52.5 gr of Accurate was sending my bullets in the same holes as the ones with the varget but this was at 100 yards. Then took both loads to 500 meters and had similar results. Also heard that 4064 does well in MN, have not tried that one yet.
I am using the 174 SMK BTHP (.303) .311 diameter because my MN slugged at .313. I did try the Hornady .312 but the SMK gave better results.
Let me know if you know of a possible better bullet for ELR, I'll try it.
I wish you the best on your build and looking forward to see what your finish project (Desh) will do :thumbup:
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Re: 1555 yards and one mile, original MN sniper '43 Tula PU.

Postby 0933 » Thu Jan 23, 2014 11:41 am

Good shooting Ivan!! :thumbup:

I'm looking forward to the video!!
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Re: 1555 yards and one mile, original MN sniper '43 Tula PU.

Postby Ombre noire » Thu Jan 23, 2014 11:44 am

Shepard wrote:That is some great shooting with a stock rifle. I hope that I'm able to locate a place with that range -- Right now I have about 1200yd available and it requires a lot of walking for the people who help me. Can't wait to see the video. Keep up the good work.




Shepard

Thanks, I appreciate the comment. We are lucky to have the NV desert, gives us practically no limits on how far we can shoot :thumbup:. 1200 is all good, just depends on how big the target is :lol: When I decided to take the MN to a mile, I left my ego at home; I knew it wouldn't survive the test. Glad I did that, the target looked soooo small :shock:
I didn't shoot my MN for a while, got sidetracked with a new .338 and it was also duck season :thumbup:. Still had 23 reloads ready to go; could not miss this opportunity, as I thought of it many times in the past year.
Mu buddy Mark is still working on the video's editing; same guy who shot my prior video (Mosin at 500 meters), he does awesome work. I hope it will turn out well and that the shots are really as close to the target as what it looked like through the PU :lol:
We won't see any hits but we will see how close the misses are...never thought I would say that one day :lol:

Have a good day :thumbup:
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Re: 1555 yards and one mile, original MN sniper '43 Tula PU.

Postby Ombre noire » Thu Jan 23, 2014 11:59 am

0933 wrote:Good shooting Ivan!! :thumbup:

I'm looking forward to the video!!



Thanks man, hope all is well with you; looking forward to see it too!
We never know how Mark's videos are going to look like, as he always surprises us with cool stuff. He made one of our last duck hunting trip and, even though we didn't get many ducks on that day, we had a blast watching the video. I was actually filming randomly throughout the day; he took the camera home, worked his magic and his editing was hilarious; so even if we didn't mess around as much when shooting the mile, it should be some good stuff in it :thumbup:
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Re: 1555 yards and one mile, original MN sniper '43 Tula PU.

Postby Grimstod » Thu Jan 23, 2014 2:11 pm

For the Mosin with a 311 type barrel you really can't beet the 174 SMK. I wish we had a 190 or 200 grain option with a higher BC. Would allow us to reach just that little extra.
I have some 200gr russian target ammo and it stays ballistic (mind you these are with a ruff estimate on BC) to about 1200yards or perhaps a little farther. Higher altitude like were your shooting would probably be even a little better cause the air is thinner.
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Re: 1555 yards and one mile, original MN sniper '43 Tula PU.

Postby Shepard » Thu Jan 23, 2014 4:23 pm

Your handload -- "52.5gr of Accurate 4350 under a SMK 174gr .311 projictile." What primer did you use and what were the numbers or FPS for your round?
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Re: 1555 yards and one mile, original MN sniper '43 Tula PU.

Postby Ombre noire » Thu Jan 23, 2014 7:41 pm

Shepard wrote:Your handload -- "52.5gr of Accurate 4350 under a SMK 174gr .311 projictile." What primer did you use and what were the numbers or FPS for your round?


Federal, regular primer.
Didn't have a chronograph back then but I remember looking for a load that would be close (theoretically) to 44.6 gr of Varget, which was my go-to load. Probably wouldn't be a bad idea to see the average with both loads, as I did buy a Chrony a while ago.
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